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Russel 'Rusty' Dawe Creator Chat - Raw Transcript
As always, the live chat with a former Atari employee was a ton of fun. This is truly a great opportunity for collectors to meet the creators of their favorite games and ask them the questions they've always wanted to know. Rusty's chat was great because he so generously elaborated and a lot of cool information came out. Here is the 'original' transcript from the chat below. If you would like to see the 'nice' version of this chat that has formatting, check out the 'Rusty Dawe transcript' at Rotheblog.com.
[11:59] Welcome Rusty
[12:00] Hey folks.
[12:00] So happy you could spend an hour of your time with us here today.
[12:00] hiyas Rus
[12:00] usually we get a few that show up later...so I expect that attendance will increase as we go.
[12:00] So...my banner message
[12:00] as a reminder, if you have any questions
[12:00] pm me with those and I will ask them
[12:01] Hi Rusty
[12:01] hi everyone
[12:01] we'll keep things moving right along, and free from too much noise.
[12:01] Rusty, you ready for your iirst question?
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[12:02] I will assume yes...
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[12:03] What was the reason that Accelerator never saw the light of day? I heard that it might have been a budget issue at the time.
[12:03] No, not a budget issue...
[12:04] The game was really fun to play as long as you had two people who were about evently matched.
[12:04] Dennis Harper, the other developer (who went on to do toobin, and others) and I had some fabulous times playing the game.
[12:04] so, it didn't test well then?
[12:04] Unfortunately, it just wasn't as much fun alone, or with someone who was radically different level.
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[12:05] how many test locations was it on?
[12:05] It tested just "ok", but at that point, due to the financial issues, all games really needed to be stellar to get into production.
[12:05] mmm
[12:05] It was in just one location. We never made more than one of them.
[12:06] alright
[12:06] You know where that one is right Rusty?
[12:06] Scott Evans currently has it; he's bringing it to California Extreme this year
[12:06] We did a lot of work to try to equalize the levels (if you were too far ahead, "bad things happened", etc, put in more jump pads for the behind player, etc., but just not compelling enough unless you were head-to-head.
[12:07] Very cool. Had a lot of fun doing the game, even though it never made it.
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[12:07] I'm looking forward to getting some time on it
[12:07] you should come out to the show this year! :)
[12:07] http://www.flickr.com/photos/heyrocker/2723329855/
[12:07] Thanks.
[12:07] Ok...next question.
[12:07] Did you put any Easter eggs in any of your games, such as your name, initials, or hidden messages?
[12:07] Oh yeah... Lets see...
[12:08] Well, Cloak & Dagger had all the hidden teleporters... Not quite easter eggs, but a start.
[12:08] I was just reading about those today...
[12:08] Paperboy has many things show up if you hit hidden targets (the submarine periscope, gopher, etc.)
[12:08] wow
[12:09] In Race Driven, if you crash off the cliff in a certain way, you may see the designers initials in the sky . Very rare though.
[12:09] nice touch :)
[12:09] sweet
[12:09] You have to roll the car to see the sky, so it isn't easy or obvious.
[12:10] We weren't supposed to put in easter eggs back then that weren't directly connected to the game play.
[12:10] did we have any follow ups to this question?
[12:10] cw?
[12:11] did you want to ask him yours?
[12:11] the hut
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[12:11] was that the name of a hang out?
[12:11] in race drivin
[12:12] small building behind a house
[12:12] its got a sign that says the hut on it
[12:12] ah, no, I believe that it got that name from the artist who created it -- it looked like a hut... I could be wrong here though -- long time ago and far far away
[12:12] ok...
[12:12] anyone else?
[12:12] other follow ups to the easter egg question?
[12:12] any other easter eggs in any other titles you worked on?
[12:13] next question.
[12:13] ok.
[12:13] Not really...
[12:13] k
[12:13] here it is.
[12:13] You receive a 'special thanks' on the credits screen in 720°. What was your involvement with that game?
[12:14] I was only peripherally involved with 720, but it was otherwise the same team that did Paperboy (which I was much involved with). Still, I helped out with some of the design issues and a couple of gameplay sequence issues, plus was one of the patsy skateboarders who got banged up on our half-pipe we built in the warehouse .
[12:15] :)
[12:15] I created the motion-object engine used by 720 and a batch of other titles that came out then, too.
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[12:15] I'd like to ask a follow up to 720 if I may Jeff..
[12:15] go ahead.
[12:16] Rusty there are random blue flags that pop up in Skate City and award the player points
[12:16] are those in fact 'random' or are they based on something else
[12:16] i.e. your previous skate park performance, etc.
[12:16] it's been a topic of much debate
[12:17] They are NOT random. They were placed there carefully by Dave Ralston (who did that playfield, along with Paperboy)...
[12:17] AHHA interesting
[12:17] so they are in the code
[12:17] However, the timing of when they show up is hidden deep in the recesses of his and John Salwitz (the programmer's) devious minds.
[12:17] lol nice
[12:17] well thanks for clearing that up :)
[12:18] anyone else?
[12:18] move forward FM?
[12:18] please
[12:18] and thank you
[12:18] Of the titles you worked to create do you have a favorite?
[12:19] Well... I really liked Agent X/Cloak & Dagger. But very close is Paperboy. Certainly, for me, Paperboy was the financial winner . But C&D was lots of fun to create both technically, and game-wise.
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[12:19] and this stems from that...
[12:19] What was the relationship like with Universal when you were the main point of contact for Cloak and Dagger?
[12:19] this was my question.
[12:20] but later, I might have answered it....were you really just there to play the game?
[12:20] and for Universal to tape you playing to splice it into the film?
[12:21] It was a fabulous relationship between us. They came looking for a "spy game" and we had Agent X already well along in development. The two were a nice match, so the royalty scheme didn't favor either company. We sent them a cabinet and when I went down...
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[12:22] I worked closely with the editor of the movie, who was my "escort" the whole time. We discussed everything from syntax used in the move (the word "tape" was already recorded and so couldn't be replaced with 'cartridge' for example)
[12:22] ...to how credits could be done with a game motif.
[12:22] (like flashing on/off/on, etc.).
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[12:22] I was the one who actually plays the game in the film, though it looks a lot like the boy is playing.
[12:22] That was tough!
[12:23] I had to play on the cabinet, but they removed the monitor so that it could be filmed. The monitor was down and to the right of where I was standing, not in front!
[12:23] wow I never knew that was you, nice cameo Rusty :)
[12:23] Try to get the world's high score that way!
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[12:24] Not only that, but the movie frame rate is 24hz, the game is 30hz. So, if you closely watch the movie, you'll notice the action is a bit slow, and the sounds a bit low.
[12:24] We put in the "Final scene" in C&D with the secret stolen plans, just so they could film it for the movie. Course, it didn't do the game any harm either.
[12:24] I had a blast the week I was at Univerasl.
[12:25] Got to wander over most of the lot at will.
[12:25] that is awesome.
[12:25] Good times :)
[12:25] did you see anything of note on the lot?
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[12:26] well...that question isn't so important.
[12:26] Not too much, except for Dabny Colman and ... Thomas filming a couple of scenes. There wasn't much happening there at that moment. On the other hand, my trip to Mexico to talk with the Dune staff (incl. David Lynch & Rapheala) for a game we didn't do was full of stuff...
[12:27] But that is another story
[12:27] Let's come back to that please :)
[12:27] good stuff
[12:27] alright.
[12:27] maybe towards the end.
[12:27] next question.
[12:27] Do you currently own any games? If so which ones?
[12:27] sounds great
[12:28] I owned 13 titles when I left Atari, but I've moved 5 times since and dropped a couple with each move ... I'm now down to...
[12:29] A sitdown Star Wars, a prototype Paperboy, and one I didn't do... A "signed" Ted Nugent pinball (that sees ALOT of play).
[12:29] Actually, so does the Paperboy. My daughter (12) holds the world record (unofficial) for all three roads on that. When she's 13, I'll submit a video so it'll be legit.
[12:30] awesome, can't wait to see that
[12:30] Every time I've beaten her, she just comes back and thrashes me again.
[12:30] lol
[12:30] no fair , she would have a genetic disposition to it lol ;)
[12:30] LOL
[12:30] She's found at least 3 easter eggs I didn't even know where there.
[12:31] ...were there...
[12:31] which ones?
[12:31] I miss my C&D, and roadblasters, out of the ones I sold off.
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[12:31] There's a gopher on hard way that comes to mind. Have to ride next to a house to get it. Hard to get out without losing a life though.
[12:32] Well, we're through a half hour...
[12:32] next question?
[12:32] hard way beats me down :(
[12:33] sure
[12:33] If you were designing a coin op game today , what genre would you like to work in ? Also would you make it a button masher like most are today or would you keep it a little more linear like the classics?
[12:33] no kidding...
[12:34] I'd do a good driving sim (I enjoy those) that involved the need for some stunt work (jumping bridges, etc.) if there was a good theme to go along... Like a "Bond racer" or some such. OR, something that had humor and strategy as a part. The Dune game I proposed but didn't do comes to mind... It actually would have had you try to become "prescient", to know the future, by giving you...
[12:35] subtle hints and highlighting the colors of these differently so you would look on the screen in a special way. Would be cool with today's graphics.
[12:35] No button masher, no intense violence, no shoot-em-up.
[12:36] humor and strategy -- that is what I like...
[12:36] nice , something a little more cerebral then?
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[12:36] What? your going to do a sequel to paperboy called blogger boy with an overweight kid at the computer keyboard?
[12:36] (the story, the graphics, the fun are the thing!)
[12:36] Or, maybe we throw the kid?
[12:36] (just kidding)
[12:36] lol
[12:37] I spent alot of time after Atari doing social on-line environments... Taught me alot about interaction when you have a limited "tool set"
[12:37] I think I could do some fun games again these days.
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[12:38] Hmmm... lost a couple of posts here..
[12:38] I spent alot of time after Atari doing social on-line environments... Taught me alot about interaction when you have a limited "tool set"
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[12:38] I think I could do some fun games again these days.
[12:39] There we are.
[12:39] too bad the money aspect isnt there like back in the day
[12:39] ok...
[12:39] next question.
[12:39] thanks for elaborating Rusty.
[12:39] how old were you when you worked at Atari?
[12:39] the scroll bar moves up by itself sometimes...be aware
[12:39] that is the sort of stuff we are all looking for.
[12:40] Calculating...
[12:40] I was 29 when I joined Atari, left there when I was 39.
[12:40] Most fun job I ever had!
[12:41] It was a great group of guys (& girls) to work with.
[12:41] it was a long tenure...
[12:42] alright, let's keep moving, see if we can't fit in a few more questions.
[12:42] I know the plan for the System II cabinet was to have more than just 2 games become available for it. Were there any other games besides Paperboy and Championship Sprint on the drawing board for that cab before it was deemed that there wouldn't be anymore? That cab's a heavy beast by the way. :-)
[12:42] in the scope of the type of work yeah it was
[12:43] Not really... They turned Paperboy into a System II only because they couldn't get many presales. Paperboy tested uniquely for a video game. Most games do spectacular for a week or two then drop off. Paperboy started at a mid-level and never dropped off.
[12:43] But it was hard to convince the arcade owners it was a win proposition. By turning it into a "system" game, they thought they could make a better sales pitch.
[12:43] huh
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[12:44] ah interesting
[12:44] very
[12:44] Championship Sprint was the solution to doing another game on it to satisfy the folks who bought a system game that it really was a system. .
[12:44] Supersprint used the same processor and basic technology, so the conversion was relatively easy.
[12:44] :)
[12:45] Of course, Atari made out like a bandit with Paperboy. It was the only game they ever did a profit share on with the arcade owners (let us put this in your arcade, we share profits 50-50, you never have to buy it).
[12:46] Because it never fell off in its revenue, Atari made more than 10x as much as they would have if they'd sold them outright! That is trusting in your own market research!
[12:46] not a bad model for certain games
[12:46] Yeah, need to be very picky there...
[12:46] wow I didn't know it was a profit share title
[12:46] The only one.
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[12:46] Very intersting
[12:46] lot of games from that era were hit and run, hot one week dead the rest
[12:47] that is awesome info.
[12:47] I bet the distributors were not happy with that
[12:47] Those owners who didn't want them anymore after awhile returned them and those were turned into Champ sprint...
[12:47] No, the distributors were not pleased, but then, had they sold them, we wouldn't have done that!
[12:47] pfft middlemen anyway
[12:48] +1
[12:48] lol
[12:48] only know the games by the names on the invoice
[12:48] any other awesome insights into Paperboy and it's history?
[12:48] or should we do the next question?
[12:49] Well, it almost never saw the light of day.
[12:49] wow that coulda been a bad mistake
[12:49] not much time left (sadly) maybe we should move forward to try to get to all the questions
[12:49] ok...
[12:49] next.
[12:49] I've heard rumors that Atari had considered making Indiana Jones a laser disc game. Since you worked on Temple of doom I'm wondering if you had any info on this or had even heard of this? If there is any truth to the rumor do you have any clue what stage of development this got to?
[12:50] I took over as project leader when I first became a manager for Atari, and it was scheduled to die based on the previous project lead... We changed it to a humorous game instead of a "psycho" game, worked well. Okay, next...
[12:50] That one is news to me as well, heard about it first here.
[12:50] Sorry, no insight to add there.
[12:50] Dan
[12:50] want to ask anything related?
[12:51] ok...
[12:51] next question then
[12:51] My favorite System 1 game is Indiana Jones..I know, I know Marble Madness...So what was you involvement on the game? Was anything dropped? Any bugs or easter eggs? Did you know anything about the laserdisc version?
[12:51] Again, for Temple of DOom, I did the motion object driver (quadrupling or more the number of items the game could display). Had fun with it though!
[12:51] we already talked about the easter egg part...
[12:52] any more questions on the list Jeff?
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[12:53] oh...I didn't pick up on that as being the answer to that question....
[12:53] ok.
[12:53] One I can answer quick... My favorite game I'd LIKE to have... Robotron 2084...
[12:53]
[12:54] C&D inspired by it, correct?
[12:54] what? that's a Williams game
[12:54] :)
[12:54] boo hiss :)
[12:54] Robotron was inspired by Berzerk
[12:54] actually that is my favorite Williams game
[12:54] anyway...this is the next question down my list Rusty...
[12:54] How hard was it to bring I, Robot to market what with all its hardware complexity and the technological "1sts" it brought to the table
[12:54] Yes, C&D was my salute to Robotron -- lots of stuff moving around, the dual-joystick controls... Have to be very "zen" to play it.
[12:55] Very tough!...
[12:55] Time to build another C&D.
[12:55] http://www.thisoldgame.com/Projects/AgentX.htm
[12:55] Atari held 3 patents on that technology. It had the first large-scale custom ICs, it had two "quad-pokeys" -- a new way of getting more sound effecst in, challenging!
[12:56] yeah...don't know if Rusty even knows about the Agent X / C&D repro artwork project that has been ongoing for almost three years now.
[12:56] Not only that, the market was going through one of its cycles... Always a tough time for inovation.
[12:56] Yeah, I've took a look at the repro stuff -- very nice!
[12:56] I need my Indiana Jones stories.....
[12:56] ...taken a look...
[12:57] how do you feel about the stuff being repro'd and restored?
[12:57] Sorry, I don't have much on Indy -- did that driver for the innards of the game, didn't get too involved with the gameplay part.
[12:57] re: I, Robot, no doubt. And cool I'm glad you saw the C&D art project page...a lot of blood sweat and tears have gone into that :)
[12:58] That I can believe. I think it is great to restore it. Shows the interest is high, and a commitment that matches.
[12:58] Your involvement on Batman
[12:58] The biggest tears will be if I dont get a set of the art :)
[12:58] Easy Chris.
[12:58] Did we finish answering the I, Robot question?
[12:58] Atari?
[12:58] yes all good
[12:58] I believe I have a set of original side panels from C&D, but I can't bloody find 'em right now... Buried in the basement somewhere, I'm guessing.
[12:58] alright.
[12:59] were those sides really drawn with marker? or hand drawn?
[12:59] They were hand drawn and colored by our art staff, like all the other artwork. However, they were going for a certain "style" that made it look that way.
[13:00] Solid colors, blocked shapes, etc.
[13:00] initially directly on the cabinet?
[13:00] No, they would run off these printouts on these monstrous decals that were the size of the cabinet.
[13:01] ok....well, can we get in one more question?
[13:01] what is the reason you went with the crystal castles cab for C&D instead of an original design
[13:01] oops sorry jeff
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[13:01] np
[13:01] it's related
[13:01] That was the production staff's call. I was more interested in the audio quality, etc. and wasn't too critical of the cabinet for that game, anyway.
[13:02] Who would be the person that would have made that call?
[13:02] or might know?
[13:02] probably had extras lying around :) not like they needed many; only what 20 dedicated units were produced yes?
[13:02] Crystals castles cab worked, and besides, we were only doing a pre-prod run of 20. So, we used what was on hand.
[13:03] On those dedicated cabs, was an ARII used for amplification and power?
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[13:03] Yes, I believe it was -- it was a standard used by all the games at that time. Except that we used two audio boards since we were trying to get stereo.
[13:04] I have a pic of the setup Jeremy I can forward to you
[13:04] ok....
[13:04] Please do! :)
[13:04] ha ha...the Batman question.
[13:04] What are your thoughts on Batman. And be Honest!
[13:05] Well, I thought it was pretty weak. They were being rushed to get it out and some of the more subtle gameplay features never made it in, and the graphics were also rushed.
[13:06] concur on the 'weakness' :)
[13:06] The team did an amazing job considering the timeframe. Most games took 12-18 months. Batman took 6.
[13:06] what klind of features?
[13:06] lol
[13:06] ah....we have heard similar things in the past 5-6 chats.
[13:07] those darn licenses
[13:07] There were going to be additional goodies to pick up that would let you fly, etc. There was a whole scene that never made it with airial stunts...
[13:07] Yup, license issues.
[13:08] any other questions we didn't get to Jeff?
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[13:08] Kelly and Norm did Batman (also SuperSprint, Vindicators). A good team.
[13:08] well...
[13:08] Rusty, do you have to head?
[13:09] we appreciate you staying 10 minutes over.
[13:09] Nope, here till you drop .
[13:09] nice :)
[13:09] trooper
[13:09] alrighty
[13:09] (poor bugger ) ;)
[13:09] well, there are others then.
[13:09] sounds great
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[13:09] I assume the answer to this one already came out.
[13:09] What is your "holy grail" arcade machine if you could only own one?
[13:09] Well, I have to run. Thanks for being here Rusty.
[13:09] Would this be Robotron?
[13:10] later Bill
[13:10] Yup, Robotron. Really got into that game. Had an ongoing challenge with another developer and we really got deep into that game.
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[13:11] 500k deep? 1m?
[13:11] 3M
[13:11] 3m?
[13:11] nuice
[13:11] Stopped moving the eyes -- just kind of blank stared and moved the controls. Amazing.
[13:12] another question?
[13:12] Did you work on Marble Madness II: Marble Man at all?
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[13:12] if anyone else thinks of questions, pm me with them.
[13:12] Nope, happened after I left. Not sure if that was only being done to support the home market, either. Some games like Paperboy II were done for that.
[13:13] I was going to say
[13:13] Mark Cerny did Marble. Fabulous designer. Really brilliant.
[13:13] I don't know my history on the game
[13:13] but didn't understand the gap in release btw 1 & 2
[13:13] next question on the list...
[13:14] Do you have any crazy late night Atari stories similar to Eugene Jarvis's wild parties and game creation sessions?
[13:14] Me neither. I was there at least 5 years after Marble and it never came up as something to do seriously (almost all games get talked about a little that way).
[13:14] Hehehe...
[13:14] :)
[13:14] hahahaha
[13:14] Well, have you heard the Firefox team's version of what went down before the show yet?
[13:14] no..do tell
[13:14] nope
[13:14] Well...
[13:14] ears open
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[13:15] THey had a very cool proto cabinet that looked like the Firefox fighter cabinet, but they were having serious issues getting the laserdisc to behave, so...
[13:15] they sent the cabinet on to San Antonio with the hardware while the team stayed behind to finish programming...
[13:16] However, even with a multi-day 24 hours non-stop effort, they still didn't have it done, so Warner sent their private jet to wait for them in San Jose to bring the Roms...
[13:16] classic
[13:17] But, they still didn't get it (even after calling in some of the rest of us from other projects to help -- which IMHO only made things worse )... Planes can't take off from San Jose after 11, so they moved the jet to Oakland...
[13:17] The team still wasn't done at 4am and the show opened at 10am... So...
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[13:17] They MAME'd it?! :D
[13:18] They stole the EPROM programmer and PAL programmers from the chip lab, took all their computers, hardeware, etc. and got on the plane.
[13:18] oy
[13:18] On the way, they called ahead for pizza to Albuquerqie where the plane landed and picked it up for them. Met 'em on the runway.
[13:18] :)
[13:18] Got to the show before it opened, but still couldn'
[13:18] Got to the show before it opened, but still couldn't get it to work right, so...
[13:19] BTW I love this live chat Jeff, thank you!!!
[13:19] They went one day, then two, then the whole show with this incredible cabinet that people got to sit in BUT NO GAME. Was a huge success. The rest of us decided we didn't need to do games anymore!
[13:19] np, I'm as geeked as you to hear this.
[13:19] lol
[13:20] Lets see, then there was the Pole Position rehab for me...
[13:20] Hahahaha
[13:20] thank God that FF cab had merit all on it's own :)
[13:20] I was playing that one in the lab after hours A LOT! Had it very wired.
[13:20] Held record on every track in the labs...
[13:21] Great story Rusty. Too bad they never got it working in time, but sounds like they had fun trying.
[13:21] Yup, calling ahead for pizza from the plane is a classic.
[13:21] Definitely
[13:21] crunch isn't the most fun, but it makes for good stories :]
[13:22] another question on the list.
[13:22] Did you come up with the idea for the game play of Rampart? It's pretty inventive; many have described it as Missile Command meets Tetris.
[13:22] So, with PP, after playing for about 3 hours one night, I drove home. At that time I was driving a Porsche 924S... I only lived about 3 miles away, BUT here I am on Montegue Expwy and there is an "S" curve with two cars sitting on it.
[13:22] Sold my Rampart last week... GREAT game just outta room!
[13:22] sorry.
[13:22] keep going Rusty.
[13:23] up oh..I see where this story is going... :)
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[13:23] It was identical to the PP setup on one of its curves... Speed limit of 50 with 3 lanes. Shot between the two cars and was going 140 when I came out the other side. Zipped through the signal (green, thank god) and realized what I'd done... Needless to say, no more PP for me for awhile. had to do some rehab!
[13:24] LOL nice
[13:24] Okay, next! Also fortunately, no cops in the area...
[13:24] whew
[13:24] lol
[13:24] well...
[13:24] Heart was going about 200.
[13:24] the one I had pasted above was the Rampart question.
[13:24] Did you come up with the idea for the game play of Rampart? It's pretty inventive; many have described it as Missile Command meets Tetris.
[13:25] Kept telling myself after that "This is NOT Pole Position!"
[13:25] Ah, Loved Rampart...
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[13:25] LOL, life is not Pole Position... :D
[13:26] hi all, thanks for coming rusty
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[13:26] It was actually a takeoff on a game we were playing in the labs at the time (much simpler game, and not the same, but had the "lobbing" effect).
[13:26] When the ships were added, it really took off.
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[13:27] Was there ever a complete beheading scene or just the pic of the guillitine?
[13:27] ANother Salwitz/Ralston creation. But I would say I certainly had a piece of that one too, as I was living in that lab for awhile.
[13:27] you 'behead' by moving the trackball
[13:27] what?!?!
[13:27] yea
[13:27] There was a behading. Is, isn't there?
[13:27] :)
[13:27] yes there is
[13:27] All the years I played and owned I didn't know that?!
[13:28] Karl just didn't figure that out :)
[13:28] DOH!!
[13:28] :)
[13:28] Hehe... Remember Salwitz/Ralston = DEVIOUS!
[13:28] good stuff!
[13:29] In a way, you could say it was inspired in part by the old 2600 Game Warlords...
[13:29] The multi-player action was what we were after that Warlords gave.
[13:29] love Warlords too
[13:30] have a cocktail here, it gets a lot of play at parties
[13:30] I still like the look of the upright better
[13:30] That, plus the old 800 games Mule and Archon still get play in our house.
[13:30] would be great to link 2 of them
[13:30] mule
[13:30] yeah upright owns on looks/cocktail owns on game play though
[13:30] own cocktail here, one of my favorites... I like the overlay on the upright but 4p head to head is killer
[13:31] ...thought about linking them. About a year ahead of being able to do it easily, though.
[13:31] ok...next question.
[13:31] id you design more than 6 levels for Marble Madness, and just ended up using 6 because of RAM limitations?
[13:31] id should be Did...
[13:31] Time limitations more than anything else. Had to button it up and sell it.
[13:31] who did the music/sound in mm
[13:32] How long did it take to make a level of MM?
[13:32] its fantastic
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[13:32] agreed, pimpin' music
[13:32] Whoof, well the first one took 6 months to figure out the physics and gameplay devices we could use.
[13:32] remember, send me questions so we don't overload
[13:32] and I'll add them to the short list that is left.
[13:32] After that, about 1-2 months each. I believe there were 12 that had been designed.
[13:33] I remember a black hole obstacle that didn't get used...
[13:34] we had also recently gotten the Yamaha music chip to use (and I programmed to add to the RPM sound board), so our audio group was going wild with it (MM and Paperboy being two of the first to use it).
[13:35] RPM = Rusty's Pokey Music (which later became the defacto standard all Atari music/sound effects
[13:36] lol :)
[13:36] lol
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[13:36] FM, that answer your question?
[13:36] or, did you want to follow up to that?
[13:36] yes thanks, all good
[13:37] RPM was a predecessor to MIDI. Would have used MIDI if it had been around .
[13:37] RPM worked pretty nicely :)
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[13:37] here's a question...
[13:37] if you don't want to answer...just say.
[13:38] Do you wish you could've worked under Nolan?
[13:38] Ohh good question Jeff :)
[13:38] ;)
[13:39] Hehe... Not really a big issue. Would have been okay with that too. His legacy lived on with the Arcade group for years. Though, I think they were "mostly" more responsible after his departure . We still had many recreational moments, so-to-speak.
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[13:40] wanted to get that question in about Nolan...
[13:40] but before we stray too far from MM...
[13:40] What happened to the unfinished MM levels... is it something somebody has copies of the code still? Were the other levels playable/finished?
[13:40] I was at Stanford nearby when Nolan did his first Pong. Played it at the local bar, in fact.
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[13:41] MM was Mark Cerny's baby. I was Project Lead for about the first half or so of its lifecycle (Mark became his own lead at that point as I was getting bogged down with I Robot, Paperboy, and others)...
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[13:42] He would have the answer to that, but I believe that a couple of levels were in production but never finished, and the rest just jotted down as potentials.
[13:43] I seem to remember one level having been mostly done, but was nearly uplayable by most folks, so it was canned in the interest of time and playability, both.
[13:43] ...an "expert only" level if there ever was one.
[13:43] yeah it's a tough game on factory settings; took me a long time to complete that title
[13:43] Part of the problem of MM (besides keeping the two players in sync) was that is was SO easy to make it too hard.
[13:43] well...Mark Cerny has come up on my radar as someone we might try to get...
[13:43] maybe more of a push now...
[13:44] Ask him about "Quack" .
[13:44] definitely get Cerny if he would be amenable to it
[13:44] next question.
[13:44] How was it to work with Dave Theurer on I, Robot, and also, who were some of your favorite people to work with during your 10 year tenure?
[13:46] I loved working with Dave -- he was very serious about his work but still had fun. Dennis Harper and I collaborated on a couple (like Accelerator) and I really liked working with him. John Salwitz and Dave Ralston and I teamed up for a couple -- lots of fun. I'd have to say I enjoyed nearly everyone there I worked with. All of 'em were talented, a bit whacked (a good thing), and enjoyed it.
[13:47] Ed Logg is another that comes to mind... Had a lot of games of Spaceward Ho over our local intranet with him .
[13:48] next...
[13:48] talking about Atari staff..
[13:48] Did you know the head of the Atari graphic dept., George Opperman, at all before his tragic passing in 1985?
[13:49] Yes, worked with him on several titles including C&D. Really had an eye for color and style.
[13:50] he really was a great talent
[13:50] He left his mark on almost all the early Atari arcade titles.
[13:51] Did George have a huge team to work with or was the dept. more close-knit?
[13:51] BTW, Atari had the most *****in' artwork, hands down NO if ands or buts... :D
[13:52] agreed :)
[13:52] HAHAHAHA, nice it auto edits so my vulgar mechanic mouth can't get in trouble! ;)
[13:52] He had between 5-8 really talented folks. Between them they turned out incredible work, game graphics, marketing graphics, sales brocuhres... Did any of you see the "R" rated centiped poster?
[13:52] yes I have one :)
[13:52] I haven't
[13:52] good stuff!
[13:52] me too
[13:52] is it online somewhere?
[13:53] i have one too!
[13:53] check the posters page on my site Jeff
[13:53] the one with the chick instead of the pede
[13:53] http://www.ataricade.com/posters.htm
[13:53] alright...
[13:53] next question.
[13:53] scott located one of those quack machines
[13:53] Any tricks or hidden stuff on Toobin'? What role did you have in creating it?
[13:53] Yup, an incredible art poster. They made 10k of them but got cold feet about putting 'em in the game as a promotion. Ended up destroying all but a couple hundred that they game to engineering and other staff.
[13:54] wow 10K!
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[13:54] I heard that girl worked in the HR dept. at Atari, that true?
[13:55] Toobin was Dennis Harpers baby... My role was (again) supplying the motion object driver, but also to playtest and help suggest some gameplay fixes/mods to help in certain situations that could cause players to get stuck.
[13:55] Heard that about the girl too, not sure if its true.
[13:55] no larger version huh...ah well.
[13:55] cool thanks
[13:55] Dennis and I had just come off doing Accelerator, so were still good game-playing buds.
[13:55] will have to do a general search.
[13:56] I have a large version
[13:56] I remember that there ARE easter eggs in toobin, but couldn't tell you where they are or even what they are anymore... Been awhile since I last played it.
[13:56] were there other ideas for the controls? Or was it always a buttons-only plan?
[13:56] I just saw it for the first time in person last weekend.
[13:57] We tried a couple controls in the lab -- trackball being a fav, but the buttons lent a certain panic to the game that played (and tested) well.
[13:57] yeah I agree
[13:57] I can see that.
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[13:58] "lifelike" so-to-speak .
[13:58] I FINALLY got my Toobin' running again, only had it a year before I got to it... :p
[13:58] just a year huh? :)
[13:58] well...I only have one question left on my list.
[13:58] Talk about the Atari key club concept that never came to be.
[13:59] That was marketing's idea to try to get repeat play. C&D was a game that they felt it could be applied to that was currently approaching production, so we fixed up one cabinet with it to give it a try.
[13:59] after this we'll just open up the floor for any additional questions.
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[13:59] how did it work though?
[13:59] It was basically a flash PROM stick -- could hold a whopping 1k of memory.
[14:00] shouldn't need too much, right?
[14:00] and the player would by it and bring it with them, plug it into the front of the game or something?
[14:00] (or was that 256 bytes). EIther way, it showed promise, but not for a game like C&D so much. It would have been better tested on a role-playing type game, or something that you really needed multiple sessions on to complete.
[14:00] Yup, it allowed the player to save their current state of the game.
[14:01] LOL, they should have done that on Gauntlet! :)
[14:01] They game away a bunch of keys to players at that Arcade. About 1 in 10 actually used it.
[14:01] how much would they have cost?
[14:02] either wholesale for you...
[14:02] Yup, Guantlet, or any adventure based game. Even Tempest could have used it!
[14:02] or what you think for the user?
[14:02] They were about $30 for the reader and about $3 per key. Today it'd be about $10 for the reader and pennies for the key.
[14:03] I would have thought more expensive. Huh.
[14:03] I've never seen one of those keys surface
[14:03] ok...well, those are all the questions I have on my list to date.
[14:03] THey were planning to let the individual arcade owners sell/give away the keys.
[14:03] I think we'll open up the floor if Rusty still wants to hang and answer other questions...
[14:03] I see Stephen you had a question.
[14:03] That was "in bulk" the test reader we used was close to $100. Keys were about $3.75
[14:03] and FM you had one too.
[14:03] ah
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[14:03] I can hang for about another 15 min.
[14:03] that makes more sense.
[14:04] sure but I''ve been blabbing away the whole time: Stephen go for it
[14:04] ok
[14:04] what was teh Atari parts dept like? :-)
[14:04] :)
[14:04] Candyland!
[14:04] lol!
[14:04] lol
[14:04] schwing!
[14:05] Rusty, you just tell them when you're ready for the next question.
[14:05] Loved to wander through there... Picked up old controls, cover plates, you-name it that were in their scrap piles. An amazing set of rows and shelves.
[14:05] Have a bowling-ball sized trackball still out in the garage from there .
[14:06] Next!
[14:06] don't suppose you took any pics back then?
[14:06] Nah, not there. Didn't think about it so much then.
[14:07] FM?
[14:07] gotcha
[14:07] anyone have a question for Rusty?
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[14:07] we have about 8 min. left
[14:08] In prep for leaving (while we have a sec), just wanted to say thank you for inviting me to your chat! This has been great fun.
[14:08] I'd like to thank him for his talnets. I had a small route inthe mid 80's and he made me some decent money with his games
[14:08] so thanks Rusty!
[14:08] Thank YOU for hanging so long Rusy, we really appreciate it
[14:08] Thank you!
[14:09] it's been awesome
[14:09] Thanks rusty
[14:09] Rusty, can you dispell the myth of 500 I, Robots being dumped into the Pacific Ocean?
[14:09] This is the first time after all these years I've been able to chat about these games...
[14:09] yeah , great answers to our ?'s
[14:09] Not true.
[14:09] good elaboration on your part that makes it that much better when we don't know exactly what to ask.
[14:09] Total myth.
[14:09] I didn't think it was :)
[14:09] thanks for that confirmation
[14:09] I would have LIKED to dump about 500 I Robot controls into the Pacific -- they were a nightmare, but that didnt' happen either.
[14:09] lol
[14:10] I've had no issues with the Hall Effect though
[14:10] Thanks for answering the questions... You guys provided much of my childhood entertainment and got alot of my quarters, and ones swiped outta my mom's change jar!! :D
[14:10] ha ha.
[14:10] We were using the Hall Effect. Right.
[14:10] early versions must have been buggy
[14:10] the 2nd rev. is solid though
[14:10] don't know what that means...
[14:10] Hall Effect?
[14:10] yeah,
[14:10] it's the joystick used in I, Robot
[14:11] Road Runner
[14:11] We had an arcade in Seattle we were testing and it was playing itself sometimes! Turned out the arcade was next to a scrap yard with a monster crane magnet... Was playing the game from 100 yds away!
[14:11] Escape from the Robot Monsters
[14:11] haha thats cool
[14:11] lol craziness
[14:11] Which arcade was it in Seattle?!
[14:11] that's funny as all hell Rusty :)
[14:11] Turned out the control needed to be seperately grounded (and shielded) to the PC board. All the production controls that used the hall-effect did that after that test.
[14:12] Not sure which arcade, but we kept exchanging controls with them for months and never found the problem until they explained where they were located.
[14:12] classic :)
[14:12] Finally, the mechanical group just grounded the SH*T out of it and it started to work.
[14:13] Gave me fits trying to get the sucker produced.
[14:13] now that is a funny story
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[14:13] Well everyone, I think we need to set Rusty free
[14:13] Yup, thank you all! Enjoyed your questions and feedback.
[14:13] thanks Rus
[14:13] thanks again Rusty for being here so long, that was very generous of you
[14:13] NP!
[14:14] You guys are also the reason that I collect now! Thanks a million!!!
[14:14] Rare chance to connect with like-minded folks .
[14:14] ooooh its your fault my garage is cluttered?
[14:14] we'll be on the lookout for your daugher's world record on Paperboy when she turns 13 :)
[14:14] take care rusty
[14:14] Thanks Rusty!!! We all still enjoy your work!.....
[14:15] Thanks again! Yup, look for *edit* come November to hold the PB records... She really is an ace at it.
[14:15] ROFLMAO, Twin Galaxies will want to go thru your Paperboy with a fine tooth comb!!
[14:15] Kyra Dawe, ok will do
[14:15] That sticky substance on this or that chip... lol
[14:15] No problem, maybe they can find the intermittant loose chip I've got .
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[14:16] thanks again Rusty and have a great weekend
[14:16] bye all; my better half wants the computer now :)
[14:16] thanks to mr hanifin for a rock stable chat too!
[14:16] So it went well I take it?
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[14:17] back...got a phone call.
[14:17] it did go excellent.
[14:17] That's wonderful to hear! :-)
[14:17] I enjoyed it. Bye all!
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[14:17] Thanks again so much.
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[14:20] thanks for setting this up guys , the wifes barking , have to go grocery shopping now , can only put it off so long
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[14:20] ha ha.
[14:20] see ya Mike.
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[11:59] Welcome Rusty
[12:00] Hey folks.
[12:00] So happy you could spend an hour of your time with us here today.
[12:00] hiyas Rus
[12:00] usually we get a few that show up later...so I expect that attendance will increase as we go.
[12:00] So...my banner message
[12:00] as a reminder, if you have any questions
[12:00] pm me with those and I will ask them
[12:01] Hi Rusty
[12:01] hi everyone
[12:01] we'll keep things moving right along, and free from too much noise.
[12:01] Rusty, you ready for your iirst question?
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[12:02] I will assume yes...
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[12:03] What was the reason that Accelerator never saw the light of day? I heard that it might have been a budget issue at the time.
[12:03] No, not a budget issue...
[12:04] The game was really fun to play as long as you had two people who were about evently matched.
[12:04] Dennis Harper, the other developer (who went on to do toobin, and others) and I had some fabulous times playing the game.
[12:04] so, it didn't test well then?
[12:04] Unfortunately, it just wasn't as much fun alone, or with someone who was radically different level.
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[12:05] how many test locations was it on?
[12:05] It tested just "ok", but at that point, due to the financial issues, all games really needed to be stellar to get into production.
[12:05] mmm
[12:05] It was in just one location. We never made more than one of them.
[12:06] alright
[12:06] You know where that one is right Rusty?
[12:06] Scott Evans currently has it; he's bringing it to California Extreme this year
[12:06] We did a lot of work to try to equalize the levels (if you were too far ahead, "bad things happened", etc, put in more jump pads for the behind player, etc., but just not compelling enough unless you were head-to-head.
[12:07] Very cool. Had a lot of fun doing the game, even though it never made it.
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[12:07] I'm looking forward to getting some time on it
[12:07] you should come out to the show this year! :)
[12:07] http://www.flickr.com/photos/heyrocker/2723329855/
[12:07] Thanks.
[12:07] Ok...next question.
[12:07] Did you put any Easter eggs in any of your games, such as your name, initials, or hidden messages?
[12:07] Oh yeah... Lets see...
[12:08] Well, Cloak & Dagger had all the hidden teleporters... Not quite easter eggs, but a start.
[12:08] I was just reading about those today...
[12:08] Paperboy has many things show up if you hit hidden targets (the submarine periscope, gopher, etc.)
[12:08] wow
[12:09] In Race Driven, if you crash off the cliff in a certain way, you may see the designers initials in the sky . Very rare though.
[12:09] nice touch :)
[12:09] sweet
[12:09] You have to roll the car to see the sky, so it isn't easy or obvious.
[12:10] We weren't supposed to put in easter eggs back then that weren't directly connected to the game play.
[12:10] did we have any follow ups to this question?
[12:10] cw?
[12:11] did you want to ask him yours?
[12:11] the hut
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[12:11] was that the name of a hang out?
[12:11] in race drivin
[12:12] small building behind a house
[12:12] its got a sign that says the hut on it
[12:12] ah, no, I believe that it got that name from the artist who created it -- it looked like a hut... I could be wrong here though -- long time ago and far far away
[12:12] ok...
[12:12] anyone else?
[12:12] other follow ups to the easter egg question?
[12:12] any other easter eggs in any other titles you worked on?
[12:13] next question.
[12:13] ok.
[12:13] Not really...
[12:13] k
[12:13] here it is.
[12:13] You receive a 'special thanks' on the credits screen in 720°. What was your involvement with that game?
[12:14] I was only peripherally involved with 720, but it was otherwise the same team that did Paperboy (which I was much involved with). Still, I helped out with some of the design issues and a couple of gameplay sequence issues, plus was one of the patsy skateboarders who got banged up on our half-pipe we built in the warehouse .
[12:15] :)
[12:15] I created the motion-object engine used by 720 and a batch of other titles that came out then, too.
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[12:15] I'd like to ask a follow up to 720 if I may Jeff..
[12:15] go ahead.
[12:16] Rusty there are random blue flags that pop up in Skate City and award the player points
[12:16] are those in fact 'random' or are they based on something else
[12:16] i.e. your previous skate park performance, etc.
[12:16] it's been a topic of much debate
[12:17] They are NOT random. They were placed there carefully by Dave Ralston (who did that playfield, along with Paperboy)...
[12:17] AHHA interesting
[12:17] so they are in the code
[12:17] However, the timing of when they show up is hidden deep in the recesses of his and John Salwitz (the programmer's) devious minds.
[12:17] lol nice
[12:17] well thanks for clearing that up :)
[12:18] anyone else?
[12:18] move forward FM?
[12:18] please
[12:18] and thank you
[12:18] Of the titles you worked to create do you have a favorite?
[12:19] Well... I really liked Agent X/Cloak & Dagger. But very close is Paperboy. Certainly, for me, Paperboy was the financial winner . But C&D was lots of fun to create both technically, and game-wise.
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[12:19] and this stems from that...
[12:19] What was the relationship like with Universal when you were the main point of contact for Cloak and Dagger?
[12:19] this was my question.
[12:20] but later, I might have answered it....were you really just there to play the game?
[12:20] and for Universal to tape you playing to splice it into the film?
[12:21] It was a fabulous relationship between us. They came looking for a "spy game" and we had Agent X already well along in development. The two were a nice match, so the royalty scheme didn't favor either company. We sent them a cabinet and when I went down...
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[12:22] I worked closely with the editor of the movie, who was my "escort" the whole time. We discussed everything from syntax used in the move (the word "tape" was already recorded and so couldn't be replaced with 'cartridge' for example)
[12:22] ...to how credits could be done with a game motif.
[12:22] (like flashing on/off/on, etc.).
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[12:22] I was the one who actually plays the game in the film, though it looks a lot like the boy is playing.
[12:22] That was tough!
[12:23] I had to play on the cabinet, but they removed the monitor so that it could be filmed. The monitor was down and to the right of where I was standing, not in front!
[12:23] wow I never knew that was you, nice cameo Rusty :)
[12:23] Try to get the world's high score that way!
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[12:24] Not only that, but the movie frame rate is 24hz, the game is 30hz. So, if you closely watch the movie, you'll notice the action is a bit slow, and the sounds a bit low.
[12:24] We put in the "Final scene" in C&D with the secret stolen plans, just so they could film it for the movie. Course, it didn't do the game any harm either.
[12:24] I had a blast the week I was at Univerasl.
[12:25] Got to wander over most of the lot at will.
[12:25] that is awesome.
[12:25] Good times :)
[12:25] did you see anything of note on the lot?
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[12:26] well...that question isn't so important.
[12:26] Not too much, except for Dabny Colman and ... Thomas filming a couple of scenes. There wasn't much happening there at that moment. On the other hand, my trip to Mexico to talk with the Dune staff (incl. David Lynch & Rapheala) for a game we didn't do was full of stuff...
[12:27] But that is another story
[12:27] Let's come back to that please :)
[12:27] good stuff
[12:27] alright.
[12:27] maybe towards the end.
[12:27] next question.
[12:27] Do you currently own any games? If so which ones?
[12:27] sounds great
[12:28] I owned 13 titles when I left Atari, but I've moved 5 times since and dropped a couple with each move ... I'm now down to...
[12:29] A sitdown Star Wars, a prototype Paperboy, and one I didn't do... A "signed" Ted Nugent pinball (that sees ALOT of play).
[12:29] Actually, so does the Paperboy. My daughter (12) holds the world record (unofficial) for all three roads on that. When she's 13, I'll submit a video so it'll be legit.
[12:30] awesome, can't wait to see that
[12:30] Every time I've beaten her, she just comes back and thrashes me again.
[12:30] lol
[12:30] no fair , she would have a genetic disposition to it lol ;)
[12:30] LOL
[12:30] She's found at least 3 easter eggs I didn't even know where there.
[12:31] ...were there...
[12:31] which ones?
[12:31] I miss my C&D, and roadblasters, out of the ones I sold off.
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[12:31] There's a gopher on hard way that comes to mind. Have to ride next to a house to get it. Hard to get out without losing a life though.
[12:32] Well, we're through a half hour...
[12:32] next question?
[12:32] hard way beats me down :(
[12:33] sure
[12:33] If you were designing a coin op game today , what genre would you like to work in ? Also would you make it a button masher like most are today or would you keep it a little more linear like the classics?
[12:33] no kidding...
[12:34] I'd do a good driving sim (I enjoy those) that involved the need for some stunt work (jumping bridges, etc.) if there was a good theme to go along... Like a "Bond racer" or some such. OR, something that had humor and strategy as a part. The Dune game I proposed but didn't do comes to mind... It actually would have had you try to become "prescient", to know the future, by giving you...
[12:35] subtle hints and highlighting the colors of these differently so you would look on the screen in a special way. Would be cool with today's graphics.
[12:35] No button masher, no intense violence, no shoot-em-up.
[12:36] humor and strategy -- that is what I like...
[12:36] nice , something a little more cerebral then?
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[12:36] What? your going to do a sequel to paperboy called blogger boy with an overweight kid at the computer keyboard?
[12:36] (the story, the graphics, the fun are the thing!)
[12:36] Or, maybe we throw the kid?
[12:36] (just kidding)
[12:36] lol
[12:37] I spent alot of time after Atari doing social on-line environments... Taught me alot about interaction when you have a limited "tool set"
[12:37] I think I could do some fun games again these days.
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[12:38] Hmmm... lost a couple of posts here..
[12:38] I spent alot of time after Atari doing social on-line environments... Taught me alot about interaction when you have a limited "tool set"
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[12:38] I think I could do some fun games again these days.
[12:39] There we are.
[12:39] too bad the money aspect isnt there like back in the day
[12:39] ok...
[12:39] next question.
[12:39] thanks for elaborating Rusty.
[12:39] how old were you when you worked at Atari?
[12:39] the scroll bar moves up by itself sometimes...be aware
[12:39] that is the sort of stuff we are all looking for.
[12:40] Calculating...
[12:40] I was 29 when I joined Atari, left there when I was 39.
[12:40] Most fun job I ever had!
[12:41] It was a great group of guys (& girls) to work with.
[12:41] it was a long tenure...
[12:42] alright, let's keep moving, see if we can't fit in a few more questions.
[12:42] I know the plan for the System II cabinet was to have more than just 2 games become available for it. Were there any other games besides Paperboy and Championship Sprint on the drawing board for that cab before it was deemed that there wouldn't be anymore? That cab's a heavy beast by the way. :-)
[12:42] in the scope of the type of work yeah it was
[12:43] Not really... They turned Paperboy into a System II only because they couldn't get many presales. Paperboy tested uniquely for a video game. Most games do spectacular for a week or two then drop off. Paperboy started at a mid-level and never dropped off.
[12:43] But it was hard to convince the arcade owners it was a win proposition. By turning it into a "system" game, they thought they could make a better sales pitch.
[12:43] huh
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[12:44] ah interesting
[12:44] very
[12:44] Championship Sprint was the solution to doing another game on it to satisfy the folks who bought a system game that it really was a system. .
[12:44] Supersprint used the same processor and basic technology, so the conversion was relatively easy.
[12:44] :)
[12:45] Of course, Atari made out like a bandit with Paperboy. It was the only game they ever did a profit share on with the arcade owners (let us put this in your arcade, we share profits 50-50, you never have to buy it).
[12:46] Because it never fell off in its revenue, Atari made more than 10x as much as they would have if they'd sold them outright! That is trusting in your own market research!
[12:46] not a bad model for certain games
[12:46] Yeah, need to be very picky there...
[12:46] wow I didn't know it was a profit share title
[12:46] The only one.
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[12:46] Very intersting
[12:46] lot of games from that era were hit and run, hot one week dead the rest
[12:47] that is awesome info.
[12:47] I bet the distributors were not happy with that
[12:47] Those owners who didn't want them anymore after awhile returned them and those were turned into Champ sprint...
[12:47] No, the distributors were not pleased, but then, had they sold them, we wouldn't have done that!
[12:47] pfft middlemen anyway
[12:48] +1
[12:48] lol
[12:48] only know the games by the names on the invoice
[12:48] any other awesome insights into Paperboy and it's history?
[12:48] or should we do the next question?
[12:49] Well, it almost never saw the light of day.
[12:49] wow that coulda been a bad mistake
[12:49] not much time left (sadly) maybe we should move forward to try to get to all the questions
[12:49] ok...
[12:49] next.
[12:49] I've heard rumors that Atari had considered making Indiana Jones a laser disc game. Since you worked on Temple of doom I'm wondering if you had any info on this or had even heard of this? If there is any truth to the rumor do you have any clue what stage of development this got to?
[12:50] I took over as project leader when I first became a manager for Atari, and it was scheduled to die based on the previous project lead... We changed it to a humorous game instead of a "psycho" game, worked well. Okay, next...
[12:50] That one is news to me as well, heard about it first here.
[12:50] Sorry, no insight to add there.
[12:50] Dan
[12:50] want to ask anything related?
[12:51] ok...
[12:51] next question then
[12:51] My favorite System 1 game is Indiana Jones..I know, I know Marble Madness...So what was you involvement on the game? Was anything dropped? Any bugs or easter eggs? Did you know anything about the laserdisc version?
[12:51] Again, for Temple of DOom, I did the motion object driver (quadrupling or more the number of items the game could display). Had fun with it though!
[12:51] we already talked about the easter egg part...
[12:52] any more questions on the list Jeff?
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[12:53] oh...I didn't pick up on that as being the answer to that question....
[12:53] ok.
[12:53] One I can answer quick... My favorite game I'd LIKE to have... Robotron 2084...
[12:53]
[12:54] C&D inspired by it, correct?
[12:54] what? that's a Williams game
[12:54] :)
[12:54] boo hiss :)
[12:54] Robotron was inspired by Berzerk
[12:54] actually that is my favorite Williams game
[12:54] anyway...this is the next question down my list Rusty...
[12:54] How hard was it to bring I, Robot to market what with all its hardware complexity and the technological "1sts" it brought to the table
[12:54] Yes, C&D was my salute to Robotron -- lots of stuff moving around, the dual-joystick controls... Have to be very "zen" to play it.
[12:55] Very tough!...
[12:55] Time to build another C&D.
[12:55] http://www.thisoldgame.com/Projects/AgentX.htm
[12:55] Atari held 3 patents on that technology. It had the first large-scale custom ICs, it had two "quad-pokeys" -- a new way of getting more sound effecst in, challenging!
[12:56] yeah...don't know if Rusty even knows about the Agent X / C&D repro artwork project that has been ongoing for almost three years now.
[12:56] Not only that, the market was going through one of its cycles... Always a tough time for inovation.
[12:56] Yeah, I've took a look at the repro stuff -- very nice!
[12:56] I need my Indiana Jones stories.....
[12:56] ...taken a look...
[12:57] how do you feel about the stuff being repro'd and restored?
[12:57] Sorry, I don't have much on Indy -- did that driver for the innards of the game, didn't get too involved with the gameplay part.
[12:57] re: I, Robot, no doubt. And cool I'm glad you saw the C&D art project page...a lot of blood sweat and tears have gone into that :)
[12:58] That I can believe. I think it is great to restore it. Shows the interest is high, and a commitment that matches.
[12:58] Your involvement on Batman
[12:58] The biggest tears will be if I dont get a set of the art :)
[12:58] Easy Chris.
[12:58] Did we finish answering the I, Robot question?
[12:58] Atari?
[12:58] yes all good
[12:58] I believe I have a set of original side panels from C&D, but I can't bloody find 'em right now... Buried in the basement somewhere, I'm guessing.
[12:58] alright.
[12:59] were those sides really drawn with marker? or hand drawn?
[12:59] They were hand drawn and colored by our art staff, like all the other artwork. However, they were going for a certain "style" that made it look that way.
[13:00] Solid colors, blocked shapes, etc.
[13:00] initially directly on the cabinet?
[13:00] No, they would run off these printouts on these monstrous decals that were the size of the cabinet.
[13:01] ok....well, can we get in one more question?
[13:01] what is the reason you went with the crystal castles cab for C&D instead of an original design
[13:01] oops sorry jeff
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[13:01] np
[13:01] it's related
[13:01] That was the production staff's call. I was more interested in the audio quality, etc. and wasn't too critical of the cabinet for that game, anyway.
[13:02] Who would be the person that would have made that call?
[13:02] or might know?
[13:02] probably had extras lying around :) not like they needed many; only what 20 dedicated units were produced yes?
[13:02] Crystals castles cab worked, and besides, we were only doing a pre-prod run of 20. So, we used what was on hand.
[13:03] On those dedicated cabs, was an ARII used for amplification and power?
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[13:03] Yes, I believe it was -- it was a standard used by all the games at that time. Except that we used two audio boards since we were trying to get stereo.
[13:04] I have a pic of the setup Jeremy I can forward to you
[13:04] ok....
[13:04] Please do! :)
[13:04] ha ha...the Batman question.
[13:04] What are your thoughts on Batman. And be Honest!
[13:05] Well, I thought it was pretty weak. They were being rushed to get it out and some of the more subtle gameplay features never made it in, and the graphics were also rushed.
[13:06] concur on the 'weakness' :)
[13:06] The team did an amazing job considering the timeframe. Most games took 12-18 months. Batman took 6.
[13:06] what klind of features?
[13:06] lol
[13:06] ah....we have heard similar things in the past 5-6 chats.
[13:07] those darn licenses
[13:07] There were going to be additional goodies to pick up that would let you fly, etc. There was a whole scene that never made it with airial stunts...
[13:07] Yup, license issues.
[13:08] any other questions we didn't get to Jeff?
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[13:08] Kelly and Norm did Batman (also SuperSprint, Vindicators). A good team.
[13:08] well...
[13:08] Rusty, do you have to head?
[13:09] we appreciate you staying 10 minutes over.
[13:09] Nope, here till you drop .
[13:09] nice :)
[13:09] trooper
[13:09] alrighty
[13:09] (poor bugger ) ;)
[13:09] well, there are others then.
[13:09] sounds great
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[13:09] I assume the answer to this one already came out.
[13:09] What is your "holy grail" arcade machine if you could only own one?
[13:09] Well, I have to run. Thanks for being here Rusty.
[13:09] Would this be Robotron?
[13:10] later Bill
[13:10] Yup, Robotron. Really got into that game. Had an ongoing challenge with another developer and we really got deep into that game.
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[13:11] 500k deep? 1m?
[13:11] 3M
[13:11] 3m?
[13:11] nuice
[13:11] Stopped moving the eyes -- just kind of blank stared and moved the controls. Amazing.
[13:12] another question?
[13:12] Did you work on Marble Madness II: Marble Man at all?
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[13:12] if anyone else thinks of questions, pm me with them.
[13:12] Nope, happened after I left. Not sure if that was only being done to support the home market, either. Some games like Paperboy II were done for that.
[13:13] I was going to say
[13:13] Mark Cerny did Marble. Fabulous designer. Really brilliant.
[13:13] I don't know my history on the game
[13:13] but didn't understand the gap in release btw 1 & 2
[13:13] next question on the list...
[13:14] Do you have any crazy late night Atari stories similar to Eugene Jarvis's wild parties and game creation sessions?
[13:14] Me neither. I was there at least 5 years after Marble and it never came up as something to do seriously (almost all games get talked about a little that way).
[13:14] Hehehe...
[13:14] :)
[13:14] hahahaha
[13:14] Well, have you heard the Firefox team's version of what went down before the show yet?
[13:14] no..do tell
[13:14] nope
[13:14] Well...
[13:14] ears open
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[13:15] THey had a very cool proto cabinet that looked like the Firefox fighter cabinet, but they were having serious issues getting the laserdisc to behave, so...
[13:15] they sent the cabinet on to San Antonio with the hardware while the team stayed behind to finish programming...
[13:16] However, even with a multi-day 24 hours non-stop effort, they still didn't have it done, so Warner sent their private jet to wait for them in San Jose to bring the Roms...
[13:16] classic
[13:17] But, they still didn't get it (even after calling in some of the rest of us from other projects to help -- which IMHO only made things worse )... Planes can't take off from San Jose after 11, so they moved the jet to Oakland...
[13:17] The team still wasn't done at 4am and the show opened at 10am... So...
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[13:17] They MAME'd it?! :D
[13:18] They stole the EPROM programmer and PAL programmers from the chip lab, took all their computers, hardeware, etc. and got on the plane.
[13:18] oy
[13:18] On the way, they called ahead for pizza to Albuquerqie where the plane landed and picked it up for them. Met 'em on the runway.
[13:18] :)
[13:18] Got to the show before it opened, but still couldn'
[13:18] Got to the show before it opened, but still couldn't get it to work right, so...
[13:19] BTW I love this live chat Jeff, thank you!!!
[13:19] They went one day, then two, then the whole show with this incredible cabinet that people got to sit in BUT NO GAME. Was a huge success. The rest of us decided we didn't need to do games anymore!
[13:19] np, I'm as geeked as you to hear this.
[13:19] lol
[13:20] Lets see, then there was the Pole Position rehab for me...
[13:20] Hahahaha
[13:20] thank God that FF cab had merit all on it's own :)
[13:20] I was playing that one in the lab after hours A LOT! Had it very wired.
[13:20] Held record on every track in the labs...
[13:21] Great story Rusty. Too bad they never got it working in time, but sounds like they had fun trying.
[13:21] Yup, calling ahead for pizza from the plane is a classic.
[13:21] Definitely
[13:21] crunch isn't the most fun, but it makes for good stories :]
[13:22] another question on the list.
[13:22] Did you come up with the idea for the game play of Rampart? It's pretty inventive; many have described it as Missile Command meets Tetris.
[13:22] So, with PP, after playing for about 3 hours one night, I drove home. At that time I was driving a Porsche 924S... I only lived about 3 miles away, BUT here I am on Montegue Expwy and there is an "S" curve with two cars sitting on it.
[13:22] Sold my Rampart last week... GREAT game just outta room!
[13:22] sorry.
[13:22] keep going Rusty.
[13:23] up oh..I see where this story is going... :)
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[13:23] It was identical to the PP setup on one of its curves... Speed limit of 50 with 3 lanes. Shot between the two cars and was going 140 when I came out the other side. Zipped through the signal (green, thank god) and realized what I'd done... Needless to say, no more PP for me for awhile. had to do some rehab!
[13:24] LOL nice
[13:24] Okay, next! Also fortunately, no cops in the area...
[13:24] whew
[13:24] lol
[13:24] well...
[13:24] Heart was going about 200.
[13:24] the one I had pasted above was the Rampart question.
[13:24] Did you come up with the idea for the game play of Rampart? It's pretty inventive; many have described it as Missile Command meets Tetris.
[13:25] Kept telling myself after that "This is NOT Pole Position!"
[13:25] Ah, Loved Rampart...
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[13:25] LOL, life is not Pole Position... :D
[13:26] hi all, thanks for coming rusty
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[13:26] It was actually a takeoff on a game we were playing in the labs at the time (much simpler game, and not the same, but had the "lobbing" effect).
[13:26] When the ships were added, it really took off.
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[13:27] Was there ever a complete beheading scene or just the pic of the guillitine?
[13:27] ANother Salwitz/Ralston creation. But I would say I certainly had a piece of that one too, as I was living in that lab for awhile.
[13:27] you 'behead' by moving the trackball
[13:27] what?!?!
[13:27] yea
[13:27] There was a behading. Is, isn't there?
[13:27] :)
[13:27] yes there is
[13:27] All the years I played and owned I didn't know that?!
[13:28] Karl just didn't figure that out :)
[13:28] DOH!!
[13:28] :)
[13:28] Hehe... Remember Salwitz/Ralston = DEVIOUS!
[13:28] good stuff!
[13:29] In a way, you could say it was inspired in part by the old 2600 Game Warlords...
[13:29] The multi-player action was what we were after that Warlords gave.
[13:29] love Warlords too
[13:30] have a cocktail here, it gets a lot of play at parties
[13:30] I still like the look of the upright better
[13:30] That, plus the old 800 games Mule and Archon still get play in our house.
[13:30] would be great to link 2 of them
[13:30] mule
[13:30] yeah upright owns on looks/cocktail owns on game play though
[13:30] own cocktail here, one of my favorites... I like the overlay on the upright but 4p head to head is killer
[13:31] ...thought about linking them. About a year ahead of being able to do it easily, though.
[13:31] ok...next question.
[13:31] id you design more than 6 levels for Marble Madness, and just ended up using 6 because of RAM limitations?
[13:31] id should be Did...
[13:31] Time limitations more than anything else. Had to button it up and sell it.
[13:31] who did the music/sound in mm
[13:32] How long did it take to make a level of MM?
[13:32] its fantastic
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[13:32] agreed, pimpin' music
[13:32] Whoof, well the first one took 6 months to figure out the physics and gameplay devices we could use.
[13:32] remember, send me questions so we don't overload
[13:32] and I'll add them to the short list that is left.
[13:32] After that, about 1-2 months each. I believe there were 12 that had been designed.
[13:33] I remember a black hole obstacle that didn't get used...
[13:34] we had also recently gotten the Yamaha music chip to use (and I programmed to add to the RPM sound board), so our audio group was going wild with it (MM and Paperboy being two of the first to use it).
[13:35] RPM = Rusty's Pokey Music (which later became the defacto standard all Atari music/sound effects
[13:36] lol :)
[13:36] lol
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[13:36] FM, that answer your question?
[13:36] or, did you want to follow up to that?
[13:36] yes thanks, all good
[13:37] RPM was a predecessor to MIDI. Would have used MIDI if it had been around .
[13:37] RPM worked pretty nicely :)
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[13:37] here's a question...
[13:37] if you don't want to answer...just say.
[13:38] Do you wish you could've worked under Nolan?
[13:38] Ohh good question Jeff :)
[13:38] ;)
[13:39] Hehe... Not really a big issue. Would have been okay with that too. His legacy lived on with the Arcade group for years. Though, I think they were "mostly" more responsible after his departure . We still had many recreational moments, so-to-speak.
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[13:40] wanted to get that question in about Nolan...
[13:40] but before we stray too far from MM...
[13:40] What happened to the unfinished MM levels... is it something somebody has copies of the code still? Were the other levels playable/finished?
[13:40] I was at Stanford nearby when Nolan did his first Pong. Played it at the local bar, in fact.
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[13:41] MM was Mark Cerny's baby. I was Project Lead for about the first half or so of its lifecycle (Mark became his own lead at that point as I was getting bogged down with I Robot, Paperboy, and others)...
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[13:42] He would have the answer to that, but I believe that a couple of levels were in production but never finished, and the rest just jotted down as potentials.
[13:43] I seem to remember one level having been mostly done, but was nearly uplayable by most folks, so it was canned in the interest of time and playability, both.
[13:43] ...an "expert only" level if there ever was one.
[13:43] yeah it's a tough game on factory settings; took me a long time to complete that title
[13:43] Part of the problem of MM (besides keeping the two players in sync) was that is was SO easy to make it too hard.
[13:43] well...Mark Cerny has come up on my radar as someone we might try to get...
[13:43] maybe more of a push now...
[13:44] Ask him about "Quack" .
[13:44] definitely get Cerny if he would be amenable to it
[13:44] next question.
[13:44] How was it to work with Dave Theurer on I, Robot, and also, who were some of your favorite people to work with during your 10 year tenure?
[13:46] I loved working with Dave -- he was very serious about his work but still had fun. Dennis Harper and I collaborated on a couple (like Accelerator) and I really liked working with him. John Salwitz and Dave Ralston and I teamed up for a couple -- lots of fun. I'd have to say I enjoyed nearly everyone there I worked with. All of 'em were talented, a bit whacked (a good thing), and enjoyed it.
[13:47] Ed Logg is another that comes to mind... Had a lot of games of Spaceward Ho over our local intranet with him .
[13:48] next...
[13:48] talking about Atari staff..
[13:48] Did you know the head of the Atari graphic dept., George Opperman, at all before his tragic passing in 1985?
[13:49] Yes, worked with him on several titles including C&D. Really had an eye for color and style.
[13:50] he really was a great talent
[13:50] He left his mark on almost all the early Atari arcade titles.
[13:51] Did George have a huge team to work with or was the dept. more close-knit?
[13:51] BTW, Atari had the most *****in' artwork, hands down NO if ands or buts... :D
[13:52] agreed :)
[13:52] HAHAHAHA, nice it auto edits so my vulgar mechanic mouth can't get in trouble! ;)
[13:52] He had between 5-8 really talented folks. Between them they turned out incredible work, game graphics, marketing graphics, sales brocuhres... Did any of you see the "R" rated centiped poster?
[13:52] yes I have one :)
[13:52] I haven't
[13:52] good stuff!
[13:52] me too
[13:52] is it online somewhere?
[13:53] i have one too!
[13:53] check the posters page on my site Jeff
[13:53] the one with the chick instead of the pede
[13:53] http://www.ataricade.com/posters.htm
[13:53] alright...
[13:53] next question.
[13:53] scott located one of those quack machines
[13:53] Any tricks or hidden stuff on Toobin'? What role did you have in creating it?
[13:53] Yup, an incredible art poster. They made 10k of them but got cold feet about putting 'em in the game as a promotion. Ended up destroying all but a couple hundred that they game to engineering and other staff.
[13:54] wow 10K!
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[13:54] I heard that girl worked in the HR dept. at Atari, that true?
[13:55] Toobin was Dennis Harpers baby... My role was (again) supplying the motion object driver, but also to playtest and help suggest some gameplay fixes/mods to help in certain situations that could cause players to get stuck.
[13:55] Heard that about the girl too, not sure if its true.
[13:55] no larger version huh...ah well.
[13:55] cool thanks
[13:55] Dennis and I had just come off doing Accelerator, so were still good game-playing buds.
[13:55] will have to do a general search.
[13:56] I have a large version
[13:56] I remember that there ARE easter eggs in toobin, but couldn't tell you where they are or even what they are anymore... Been awhile since I last played it.
[13:56] were there other ideas for the controls? Or was it always a buttons-only plan?
[13:56] I just saw it for the first time in person last weekend.
[13:57] We tried a couple controls in the lab -- trackball being a fav, but the buttons lent a certain panic to the game that played (and tested) well.
[13:57] yeah I agree
[13:57] I can see that.
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[13:58] "lifelike" so-to-speak .
[13:58] I FINALLY got my Toobin' running again, only had it a year before I got to it... :p
[13:58] just a year huh? :)
[13:58] well...I only have one question left on my list.
[13:58] Talk about the Atari key club concept that never came to be.
[13:59] That was marketing's idea to try to get repeat play. C&D was a game that they felt it could be applied to that was currently approaching production, so we fixed up one cabinet with it to give it a try.
[13:59] after this we'll just open up the floor for any additional questions.
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[13:59] how did it work though?
[13:59] It was basically a flash PROM stick -- could hold a whopping 1k of memory.
[14:00] shouldn't need too much, right?
[14:00] and the player would by it and bring it with them, plug it into the front of the game or something?
[14:00] (or was that 256 bytes). EIther way, it showed promise, but not for a game like C&D so much. It would have been better tested on a role-playing type game, or something that you really needed multiple sessions on to complete.
[14:00] Yup, it allowed the player to save their current state of the game.
[14:01] LOL, they should have done that on Gauntlet! :)
[14:01] They game away a bunch of keys to players at that Arcade. About 1 in 10 actually used it.
[14:01] how much would they have cost?
[14:02] either wholesale for you...
[14:02] Yup, Guantlet, or any adventure based game. Even Tempest could have used it!
[14:02] or what you think for the user?
[14:02] They were about $30 for the reader and about $3 per key. Today it'd be about $10 for the reader and pennies for the key.
[14:03] I would have thought more expensive. Huh.
[14:03] I've never seen one of those keys surface
[14:03] ok...well, those are all the questions I have on my list to date.
[14:03] THey were planning to let the individual arcade owners sell/give away the keys.
[14:03] I think we'll open up the floor if Rusty still wants to hang and answer other questions...
[14:03] I see Stephen you had a question.
[14:03] That was "in bulk" the test reader we used was close to $100. Keys were about $3.75
[14:03] and FM you had one too.
[14:03] ah
[14:03] -NOTICE- Shane Ritter joins Chat
[14:03] I can hang for about another 15 min.
[14:03] that makes more sense.
[14:04] sure but I''ve been blabbing away the whole time: Stephen go for it
[14:04] ok
[14:04] what was teh Atari parts dept like? :-)
[14:04] :)
[14:04] Candyland!
[14:04] lol!
[14:04] lol
[14:04] schwing!
[14:05] Rusty, you just tell them when you're ready for the next question.
[14:05] Loved to wander through there... Picked up old controls, cover plates, you-name it that were in their scrap piles. An amazing set of rows and shelves.
[14:05] Have a bowling-ball sized trackball still out in the garage from there .
[14:06] Next!
[14:06] don't suppose you took any pics back then?
[14:06] Nah, not there. Didn't think about it so much then.
[14:07] FM?
[14:07] gotcha
[14:07] anyone have a question for Rusty?
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[14:07] we have about 8 min. left
[14:08] In prep for leaving (while we have a sec), just wanted to say thank you for inviting me to your chat! This has been great fun.
[14:08] I'd like to thank him for his talnets. I had a small route inthe mid 80's and he made me some decent money with his games
[14:08] so thanks Rusty!
[14:08] Thank YOU for hanging so long Rusy, we really appreciate it
[14:08] Thank you!
[14:09] it's been awesome
[14:09] Thanks rusty
[14:09] Rusty, can you dispell the myth of 500 I, Robots being dumped into the Pacific Ocean?
[14:09] This is the first time after all these years I've been able to chat about these games...
[14:09] yeah , great answers to our ?'s
[14:09] Not true.
[14:09] good elaboration on your part that makes it that much better when we don't know exactly what to ask.
[14:09] Total myth.
[14:09] I didn't think it was :)
[14:09] thanks for that confirmation
[14:09] I would have LIKED to dump about 500 I Robot controls into the Pacific -- they were a nightmare, but that didnt' happen either.
[14:09] lol
[14:10] I've had no issues with the Hall Effect though
[14:10] Thanks for answering the questions... You guys provided much of my childhood entertainment and got alot of my quarters, and ones swiped outta my mom's change jar!! :D
[14:10] ha ha.
[14:10] We were using the Hall Effect. Right.
[14:10] early versions must have been buggy
[14:10] the 2nd rev. is solid though
[14:10] don't know what that means...
[14:10] Hall Effect?
[14:10] yeah,
[14:10] it's the joystick used in I, Robot
[14:11] Road Runner
[14:11] We had an arcade in Seattle we were testing and it was playing itself sometimes! Turned out the arcade was next to a scrap yard with a monster crane magnet... Was playing the game from 100 yds away!
[14:11] Escape from the Robot Monsters
[14:11] haha thats cool
[14:11] lol craziness
[14:11] Which arcade was it in Seattle?!
[14:11] that's funny as all hell Rusty :)
[14:11] Turned out the control needed to be seperately grounded (and shielded) to the PC board. All the production controls that used the hall-effect did that after that test.
[14:12] Not sure which arcade, but we kept exchanging controls with them for months and never found the problem until they explained where they were located.
[14:12] classic :)
[14:12] Finally, the mechanical group just grounded the SH*T out of it and it started to work.
[14:13] Gave me fits trying to get the sucker produced.
[14:13] now that is a funny story
[14:13] -NOTICE- Scott Evans joins Chat
[14:13] Well everyone, I think we need to set Rusty free
[14:13] Yup, thank you all! Enjoyed your questions and feedback.
[14:13] thanks Rus
[14:13] thanks again Rusty for being here so long, that was very generous of you
[14:13] NP!
[14:14] You guys are also the reason that I collect now! Thanks a million!!!
[14:14] Rare chance to connect with like-minded folks .
[14:14] ooooh its your fault my garage is cluttered?
[14:14] we'll be on the lookout for your daugher's world record on Paperboy when she turns 13 :)
[14:14] take care rusty
[14:14] Thanks Rusty!!! We all still enjoy your work!.....
[14:15] Thanks again! Yup, look for *edit* come November to hold the PB records... She really is an ace at it.
[14:15] ROFLMAO, Twin Galaxies will want to go thru your Paperboy with a fine tooth comb!!
[14:15] Kyra Dawe, ok will do
[14:15] That sticky substance on this or that chip... lol
[14:15] No problem, maybe they can find the intermittant loose chip I've got .
[14:15] -NOTICE- Brian Hanifin joins Chat
[14:16] thanks again Rusty and have a great weekend
[14:16] bye all; my better half wants the computer now :)
[14:16] thanks to mr hanifin for a rock stable chat too!
[14:16] So it went well I take it?
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[14:17] back...got a phone call.
[14:17] it did go excellent.
[14:17] That's wonderful to hear! :-)
[14:17] I enjoyed it. Bye all!
[14:17] -NOTICE- Stephen Beall quit (timeout)
[14:17] Thanks again so much.
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[14:20] -NOTICE- pinballfixer quit (timeout)
[14:20] thanks for setting this up guys , the wifes barking , have to go grocery shopping now , can only put it off so long
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[14:20] ha ha.
[14:20] see ya Mike.
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Tags: agent-x, atari, breighton, chat, cloak, creator, dagger, dawe, russel, rusty
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